• Home Page
    • 12step
  • Reading Room
    • client care
    • orders
    • Sample Book
  • Rebellious Radio
    • Speaking/Events/Workshops
  • Secular Recovery Meetings and Links
  • Blog
  • Merch & Gift Store
  • 30Things
    • 30 THINGS: Practical Advice for Living Well by William Schaberg
Rebellion Dogs Publishing

Rebellion Dogs Publishing

  • Home Page
    • 12step
  • Reading Room
    • client care
    • orders
    • Sample Book
  • Rebellious Radio
    • Speaking/Events/Workshops
  • Secular Recovery Meetings and Links
  • Blog
  • Merch & Gift Store
  • 30Things
    • 30 THINGS: Practical Advice for Living Well by William Schaberg
Back to all posts

When the need to People Please comes up against No More Fucks To Give

Previously posted April 8, article LinkedIn Secular AA 

In our last blog, “Knives Out,” movie characters were used as an artist's conception of pluralism. We used a Whodunit drama to act out the type of scene we can see in AA culture. Diverse worldviews create a broader highway for people with alcohol use disorder to find recovery. Also true, divergent worldviews can cause tension. When a microaggression arises, do you confront, withdraw or de-escalate? Knives Out was an example of using empathy and nonviolent communication to defuse conflict. “What the world needs now is love, sweet love. It’s the only thing that there’s just too little of.” Thank you, Burt Bacharach and Hal David, for your collaboration.

 



An irreligious member in an AA discussion about “God as you understand Him,” might just talk the way others talk to fit in, be self-effacing or avoid the situation with, "I am just happy to be here. I think I'll pass today.”

People-pleasing, as a coping mechanism, has a best-before date. It takes a lot of energy, and it is self-destructive. What happens when you hit the wall? Hitting the wall can be the end of the road; there just aren't any more fucks to give.

ABOUT USING THE F-WORD

Now, if you get a knot in your stomach at the sight/sound of “Fuck,” maybe that's the way you were raised; maybe this is your empathy connecting with the feeling nonbelievers feel: uncomfortable. It is uncomfortable to have someone talk about a “God-shot” as if a providential higher power is a universal 12-step experience. It’s uncomfortable to hear atheists talked about as close-minded, or someone stating that they “feel sorry for us.”

So yes, “fuck” is a word of exclamation that will afflict the comfortable. Taking a stand, being an unabashed skeptic, will also comfort the afflicted, if there is, and there usually is, a closet agnostic or atheist in the room.  This no more fucks to give (NMFTG) stage is the end of people-pleasing. For the NMFTG, your feelings are yours to manage, not theirs. This is a breakthrough for people with codependency.

People who learned to cope by people-pleasing put others' emotional needs first. If they are triggered by conflict or the threat of conflict, a fawning trauma-response kicks in. Feeling entitled to one’s own skepticism or candour about one’s worldview is outside of the people-pleasers' comfort zone. Of the four trauma responses—flight, fight, freeze and fawn—the people-pleaser is a classic fawner. 

Dr. Ingrid Clayton explains in Psychology Today that fawning is an unconscious defence to maintain safety and connection in a real or imagined hostile environment.

 

“Although it appears like we are agreeable, it’s important to understand this as a mask for the terror that lies beneath. True self-expression is trapped, or only allowed in small doses that don’t rock the boat. Finding safety in a predatory relationship is always the priority, trumping self-esteem, self-care, and honouring ourselves as separate beings in any way. … Because fawners experience a modicum of safety while being exploited, their nervous systems become accustomed to not only tolerating chaos and exploitation, but also feeling a sense of control within them. This dynamic is the foundation for both trauma reenactment and trauma bonding. … In understanding how we were traumatized, doing exactly what we needed in order to survive, we are finally finding a truer sense of safety that doesn’t compromise any part of who we are.”[i]

Even an F-bomb can be a breakthrough: “Having had a fucking awakening as the result of these steps..” If, for the first time, a fellow member asserts survival from addiction while finding safety in community without compromise of identity. Here’s one way to translate “I just don’t have any more fucks to give.”

“I am fatigued, disenchanted, I have bottomed out in apathy for tradition, and this is my liberation from conformity to authenticity.”

This can happen in a perfectly acceptable AA meeting, going around the room on the topic of “God has a plan for me; nothing happens in God’s world by mistake; my sobriety is a miracle.” Don’t stop having these topics. And let's consider that it isn't “the path" to recovery, it's “many paths" to recovery. The concept of God, in this freethinking age, can be embraced or rejected. Doubters can choose a more humanist or secular AA recovery. Opposing views are not confusing for newcomers. How do we know what the newcomers need to hear to feel hope, connection and relatability?

Rule 62[ii]

Another AA creed that speaks to this is, “Let’s not take ourselves too seriously.” Can we agree that “I’ve got no fucks left to give" is witty; it’s a truism, it’s sassy, and it’s legit? Fuck yeah!

Ellen Scherr, Psychotherapist calls this “the Great Unfuckening — that point in midlife when your capacity to pretend, perform, and please others starts shorting out like an electrical system that’s finally had enough.” This is not getting intolerant. There is a neuroscience explanation of why we become less of a kiss-ass, starting in middle age. This is maturation. It looks like “No cushioning. No apology. No emotional labour to make your truth more palatable.”

Some of the internal and external signs of NMFTG syndrome (okay, I made the acronym up; the know-how is from clinical psychologist Ellen Scherr) are shifts in what we have the time and energy for, due in part to accumulated stress response and/or to becoming less invested in what others think. The neurological stimulus in an AA meeting that prompts monitoring from signals in our prefrontal cortex triggers us to hold hands and pray (going along to get along). When we start reacting in a new way, Scherr calls it midlife clarity—not midlife crisis.

Some of us never believed in gods. Many whose childhoods included mythology of messiahs, Easter Bunnies, Leprechauns, Santa or other well-intentioned tall tales of youth, aged out of these stories. Others bought the whole 12-steps in a literal way, in the early days. And then we became apostates, having had a rational awakening. Connection is vital to recovery from addiction, so we need to feel a sense of belonging. And we need to be integral. “Rigorous honesty” is another 12-step mantra. Sadly, our need for connection can be such that we deny or abandon our integrity. Does this ring a bell?

“Reading the room. Adjusting your tone. Softening your language. Making yourself smaller to make others comfortable. Laughing at jokes that weren’t funny. Agreeing with opinions you didn’t share. Explaining things carefully so no one feels threatened by your knowledge. … After thousands of interactions in which you’ve monitored and managed your authentic responses to maintain social harmony, something in your system starts breaking down. Not because you’re broken, but because the system was never meant to run this way indefinitely. Your brain isn’t malfunctioning. It’s finally refusing to malfunction anymore.”[iii]

Closeted non-theists in a 12-Step meeting may become small: dumbing down their comments, using apologetic or self-effacing language, or just politely passing when their turn to talk. Some of us played nice, said the right things to avoid rocking the boat. Maybe we thought a be-the-friend-you-want-and-need would be reciprocated by believers, but it was not.

When people-pleasers heard other 12-step members mocking or disparaging those of us who claimed we stay sober without a prayer-answering, sobriety-granting higher power, this reinforced our inclination to keep our views to ourselves. Running out of fucks to give, we come out of the closet and deal with the consequences. If group members react with encouragement, people-pleasing tendencies can be retired in place of being accepted just the way they are. If someone feels dismissed because of their candour, a change of venue may be in order.

FINDING MORE F’n SECULAR MEETINGS

There are secular Alcoholics Anonymous and Narcotics Anonymous and Overeaters Anonymous and ALANON meetings - no God; no problem. My first secular group was the Beyond Belief Agnostics & Freethinkers AA group held in a classroom at the University of Toronto, on Thursday evenings. That was 2009. It was such a relief not to have to start a sentence with, “I don’t mean to offend anyone, but for me …”

Just saying what I wanted to say and expecting warmth and understanding reactions took the tension out of the back of my neck. I didn’t know how much it hurt until it wasn’t an issue anymore.

Now, Beyond Belief still meets in Toronto at 7 PM on Thursday. Other face-to-face secular meetings are also available in the Greater Toronto Area. And we are on Zoom four times a week. Each day, online, we are one of dozens of Zoom meetings for atheists, agnostics and freethinkers. At every Beyond Belief meeting, our chair invites people who are with us for the first time to “Say ‘Hello,’ so we can welcome you.” Sure, there are people new to recovery; there are people shopping around and picked our Zoom code because it was at the right time, on the right day for them. It is nice to welcome everyone; new people keep the meeting fresh and vital.

But every week, there are one or two who very intentionally chose their first secular AA meeting. From them, we hear, “I’ve been sober for over ten years (or 20, or 40). No one ever told me there was secular AA. I am so glad I found you.” Through the screen, I see the same defusing of tension that I felt at my first secular meeting. They enjoy the meeting, they come back, and they engage with the members. This happens every week. Many irreligious members have a focus on recovery and all its light and shades. And many find that parroting the language of conformity has a cumulative effect. It sounds mindless, or anti-intellectual or cult-like. This can lead to feeling increasingly isolated, more like an imposter. Some people just leave AA and follow the principles they find helpful outside in the wider world. With long-term sobriety, this graduation is only going to lead to relapse in a minority of cases.

However, that's true in Russian Roulette; there's a five out of six chance of not blowing your brains out. So what's the option that may throw the bathwater out, while preserving the baby? For a good number of people, this is a migration to secular AA, NA, Al-Anon, SAA, Adult Children of Alcoholics, OA, etc. And this is what I see in my secular AA home group: the relief of people who have reached the “I have no more fucks to give” stage. They find a place to land that has the benefits and effectiveness of the recovery community they cherish, without having to pander to “preferred” language and rituals. No more pandering, no price or sacrifice, no people-pleasing to have a community of peers. I see it all the time, just about every week at my home group, as people find a place they can call home. 

This is what’s called an affinity space, and it’s not new to 12-Step meetings. Black, Indigenous and People of Colour meetings allow members to speak and congregate outside of the white person’s gaze. Women can meet without having to deal with man-splaining. The same is true for young people, LGBTQIA+ or neurodivergent members. And for non-theists, an irreligious language and approach to 12-Step sobriety is an accessibility issue. This is where we can always be authentic and always be included.

For anyone who refers people to AA, consider asking if they prefer a religious or a secular meeting. If you’d like to try it yourself, visit an open (alcoholics and non-alcoholics welcome) secular meeting.[iv]

Also, the International Conference of Secular AA (ICSAA) hosts a monthly Zoom called “Global Speaker Tour” on the first Sunday of every month at 11 AM Pacific, 2 PM East, 7 PM UTC. This meeting features a different atheist/agnostic meeting from around the world with three short speakers. You can attend, and ICSAA's monthly meetings are recorded. Listen for free at the Secular AA podcast page.[v]

 

More on Ellen Sherr @ LifeBranches.com

Secular AA: https://www.aasecular.org/

Secular NA: https://secularna.org/ :

Secular OA: https://secularovereaters.org/

Secular Al-Anon or CoDA: https://srgrecovery.org/secular-al-anon/ 

Secular Adult Children of Alcoholics: https://www.agnosticaca.org/ 


 


[i] https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/emotional-sobriety/202303/what-is-the-fawning-trauma-response

[ii] https://www.aa.org/faq/where-did-rule-62-come from AA History, 61 rules that led to chaos until Rule 62 was adopted: Don’t take ourselves so damn seriously. 

[iii] https://www.blog.lifebranches.com/p/aging-out-of-fucks-the-neuroscience

[iv] https://www.aatorontoagnostics.com/zoom-meetings

[v] https://secularaa.buzzsprout.com/ 

 

04/13/2026

  • Leave a comment
  • Share
    When the need to People Please comes up against No More Fucks To Give

    Share link

in Understanding substance use and early days of recovery, Worldviews, Religion and Recovery

Leave a comment



Beyond Belief (book)

Merch (T-shirts, mugs, gifts and fun stuff)

Sample Book

Speaking/Events/Workshops

Orders (bulk for treatment centers), booksellers, groups

Galleries

Policy 

 

 

Some images ©

  • Log out

notes
0:00/???
  1. 1
    Austin TX, WAAFTIAAC 58:26
    Austin TX, WAAFTIAAC
    by Rebellion Dogs Radio #25

    Share link

    Free
    0:00/58:26
  2. 2
    Rebellion_Dogs_27_November2016 57:55
    Rebellion_Dogs_27_November2016

    Share link

    0:00/57:55
  3. 3
    Debate Over Special Purpose Groups 58:26
    Debate Over Special Purpose Groups

    Share link

    0:00/58:26
  4. 4
    Tracy Chabala Episode 37 Rebellion Dogs Radio 1:05:16
    Tracy Chabala Episode 37 Rebellion Dogs Radio

    Share link

    0:00/1:05:16
  5. 5
    Barry Leach on Tradition Three from World Conference 1985 25:15
    Barry Leach on Tradition Three from World Conference 1985

    Share link

    0:00/25:15
  6. 6
    "Growing Along Spiritual Lines" with Joe C (atheist) and Joe R (priest) 42:46
    "Growing Along Spiritual Lines" with Joe C (atheist) and Joe R (priest)

    Share link

    Free
    0:00/42:46
  7. 7
    Episode 19 A Principle of Recovery & Sober but never Clean 54:42
    Episode 19 A Principle of Recovery & Sober but never Clean

    Share link

    0:00/54:42
  8. 8
    A House is on Fire 3:33
    A House is on Fire

    Share link

    0:00/3:33
  9. 9
    Joe C speaks in Berlin August 2021 18:17
    Joe C speaks in Berlin August 2021

    Share link

    Info
    0:00/18:17
  10. 10
    Women in Recovery with Trysh Travis 1:10:19
    Women in Recovery with Trysh Travis

    Share link

    Free
    0:00/1:10:19
  11. 11
    ORC ontario regional AA conference 2023 Craig F (Banquet) 53:56
    ORC ontario regional AA conference 2023 Craig F (Banquet)

    Share link

    0:00/53:56
  12. 12
    49 years sober Joe C at Toronto Beyond Belief Nov 27 2025 15:41
    49 years sober Joe C at Toronto Beyond Belief Nov 27 2025

    Share link

    Info
    Free
    0:00/15:41
  13. 13
    Author Joe C, AA Talk Toronto 2007 28:22
    Author Joe C, AA Talk Toronto 2007

    Share link

    0:00/28:22
  14. 14
    WeAgnosticsPanel 1990 Seatle AA WorldCovention 1:21:25
    WeAgnosticsPanel 1990 Seatle AA WorldCovention

    Share link

    0:00/1:21:25
  15. 15
    Overhaul? by Joe C., Grapevine December 2009 5:25
    Overhaul? by Joe C., Grapevine December 2009

    Share link

    0:00/5:25
  16. 16
    We Agnostics 1990 Seattle 1:21:25
    We Agnostics 1990 Seattle
    by Rebellion Dogs Publishing

    Share link

    Free
    0:00/1:21:25
  17. 17
    Mere Addiction Rebellion Dogs Radio 42 1:06:39
    Mere Addiction Rebellion Dogs Radio 42

    Share link

    0:00/1:06:39
  18. 18
    Dr. Joe Nowinski, The Science of the 12 Step fellowship and program 52:02
    Dr. Joe Nowinski, The Science of the 12 Step fellowship and program
    by Rebellion Dogs Radio

    Share link

    Free
    0:00/52:02
  19. 19
    Audio only Joe C @ Symposium on AA History 47:58
    Audio only Joe C @ Symposium on AA History

    Share link

    0:00/47:58
  20. 20
    Talk Recovery with guest Joe C on Vancouver Coop Radio 1:00:40
    Talk Recovery with guest Joe C on Vancouver Coop Radio
    by Rebellion Dogs Publishing

    Share link

    Info
    Free
    0:00/1:00:40
0:00/???